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(@legendaryk4)
Trusted Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 59
18/11/2012 6:34 pm  

Hey guys, kind of ignore the last amp posting I did, I never did end up getting the Jet City amp. I was talking to a few pals of mine and was talking about hitting some small venues. So therefore I need a half stack. I am looking at anything up to $400. I know when it comes to amps, $400 is not going to get me anything spectacular. If it is worth it I might be able to chunk out some more cash to get something near $500.The other issue arises from before. I dont care if its tube or solid state because all my sound is from my multi-fx pedal. I just need something big, loud and a nice clean sound so my pedal can shine through.

I was looking at a http://www.musiciansfriend.com/amplifiers-effects/kustom-kg100hfx-and-kg412-half-stack . Only because its cheap.

And please only suggest half stacks. I do not want a combo amp.

Thank you very much.

Legendaryk4


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(@moonrider)
Noble Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 1309
18/11/2012 10:46 pm  

Why the fixation on a half-stack? They're bulky, heavy and most are far too overpowered for small venue gigs. Not to mention take up WAY to much stage space in small venues. The Jet City 20-watt would have fit your needs perfectly, combined with a decent small PA.

Anyway, if you MUST have a "half stack" I'd suggest you keep in mind that you get what you pay for. Cheap is really not a criteria you want to use for a gigging amp. The road dishes out a LOT of abuse.

Personally, I'd go for a nice tube head around 30 watts, and a 4x10 cab. That'll cover pretty much anything you hit except for festival and arena gigs.

Playing guitar and never playing for others is like studying medicine and never working in a clinic.Moondawgs on Reverbnation


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(@legendaryk4)
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Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 59
19/11/2012 12:56 am  

Why the fixation on a half-stack? They're bulky, heavy and most are far too overpowered for small venue gigs. Not to mention take up WAY to much stage space in small venues. The Jet City 20-watt would have fit your needs perfectly, combined with a decent small PA.

Anyway, if you MUST have a "half stack" I'd suggest you keep in mind that you get what you pay for. Cheap is really not a criteria you want to use for a gigging amp. The road dishes out a LOT of abuse.

Personally, I'd go for a nice tube head around 30 watts, and a 4x10 cab. That'll cover pretty much anything you hit except for festival and arena gigs.

Thank you for the response. I have always wanted a nice big half stack. Dont know why. Would the Jet City be enough power for gigs. And if I went for a tube head and a 4x12 cab. Does the type of cab really matter? Should you try to match brands or is one set of speakers just as good as the next?

Thank You!


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(@legendaryk4)
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Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 59
19/11/2012 12:58 am  

Also, if I buy a 30w head does that mean I need a 30w cab?

Thank You!


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(@ezraplaysezra)
Reputable Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 488
19/11/2012 1:00 pm  

Wattage of the cab describes what the handling load of the speakers is - so, no. A 5 watt amp can run a 300 watt cab for example. And it is completely unimportant that the head and cabs are made by the same company. I agree moonrider completely. You get what you pay for. Half stacks look cool as hell, but they are cumbersome - my 4x12 weighs 150lbs. for $400 you're probably going to want a nice used combo - any half stack you are getting at that price, even used, will probably just make it possible for more people to hear you have terrible tone. A good decent used 4x12 used is going to cost you a minimum of $250. And speakers are the tires of your rig - good speakers are always an improvement of the over all sound - always.
No offense, but it looks to me like you are choosing image over function - we've all been there. That said I'd find something that will retain some value. Guitar center and those other stores have used sections - look for a nice peavy or something.


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(@legendaryk4)
Trusted Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 59
19/11/2012 1:16 pm  

Wattage of the cab describes what the handling load of the speakers is - so, no. A 5 watt amp can run a 300 watt cab for example. And it is completely unimportant that the head and cabs are made by the same company. I agree moonrider completely. You get what you pay for. Half stacks look cool as hell, but they are cumbersome - my 4x12 weighs 150lbs. for $400 you're probably going to want a nice used combo - any half stack you are getting at that price, even used, will probably just make it possible for more people to hear you have terrible tone. A good decent used 4x12 used is going to cost you a minimum of $250. And speakers are the tires of your rig - good speakers are always an improvement of the over all sound - always.
No offense, but it looks to me like you are choosing image over function - we've all been there. That said I'd find something that will retain some value. Guitar center and those other stores have used sections - look for a nice peavy or something.

I agree that I am probably going for the look of a half stack. But honestly I would rather get more for my money and if a decent combo in that price range can do indoor/ outdoor gigs I would get one. Now if I lean towards a combo, tube or solid? Does the wattage on a combo really matter? because it seems I cant find any tube combos in the $400 range near 100w.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/amplifiers-effects/fender-frontman-212r-100w-2x12-guitar-combo-amp#review

This looks pretty good.

Thank You.


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(@s1120)
Prominent Member
Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 852
19/11/2012 2:23 pm  

But honestly I would rather get more for my money and if a decent combo in that price range can do indoor/ outdoor gigs

OK... so Im a bit of a playing newbee...Ive never played live... but have gone to a ton of shows over the years... outside, inside, big clubs, and small shity clubs...so take my advice based on that.... Frankly the last thing I want to see at a small club is some big huge 100w stack!!! It normaly seem to be that the show will be just a wall of bouncing around white noise... Now a smal,er tube amp... under 50.. can sound pretty good in the small room... and in a large outdoor gig you can always mic it if you need to. I tell ya... look at what some of the big names play on stage... and lot of the guys are running smaller combos...

Paul B


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(@greybeard)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 5900
19/11/2012 5:32 pm  

All other things being equal, to be twice as loud as a 10 W amp, you're going to have to go up to 100W. You're also going from a few pounds to something that should be moved by a fork-lift.

If you can find a good 30W with 2 12" speakers, you should be set for most situations. As others have said, once you get too big for the 30W, you're in a place that is going to have a PA, so you can mike into that.

Best of all, it's light enough for the wife/girlfriend to carry..................... :lol:

I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?Greybeard's PagesMy Articles & Reviews on GN


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 cnev
(@cnev)
Famed Member
Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 4485
20/11/2012 12:58 am  

As someone who has just started playing shows I have to agree with Greybeard. I have a 40W Fender combo and a 50W Marshall combo both are a pain to lug around. I'm looking for something in the 20-30W range just for portability.

30W is more than enough in a small club and if not you can mic it and run through the PA.

I hear you on the full stack I'd like to have one myself. If you want it for home use go for it and if you want it for shows good luck start working out now. :D

"It's all about stickin it to the man!" It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!


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(@moonrider)
Noble Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 1309
20/11/2012 1:02 am  

Thank you for the response. I have always wanted a nice big half stack. Dont know why. Would the Jet City be enough power for gigs. And if I went for a tube head and a 4x12 cab. Does the type of cab really matter? Should you try to match brands or is one set of speakers just as good as the next?
Thank You!

Lemme tell ya story on how I lost my love for stacks.

Once upon a time, I had an Ampeg V-4 stack. This was Big Iron in every sense of the word. 90 pounds of 100 watt head, and 125 pounds of Celestion loaded cab.

it was glorious, the one outdoor gig I got to turn it up. The rest of the time It stayed on 0.5 so I wouldn't blow the windows out of whatever venue we played, or shake the light fixtures out of the ceiling of our practice room (yes, that's a true story - I still have the scar).

Then one day we got a gig at a Fan hotspot called "The Up Top Sub Shop." it was up top all right. Top of four flights of stairs. BUT, the owner asked us to load in through the kitchen - that was FIVE flights . . . of fire escape. With Ampzilla, and a full PA.

I traded that half stack in on a 1x12 combo and an amp stand the next day.
-------------------------------------------------

I'm making the assumption you're doing heavier music, and you're out for "brutal" distortion. The most musical distortion is when you can get the power tubes of a tube amp saturated and overdriven. That means the amp has to be close to it's maximum output. Maxiumum output of a 100 watt amp through a 4x12 hurts people.

To keep the bar owners happy, you usually wind up with the master volume down very low, and the preamp gain way up. Which usually sounds weak and buzzy.

If you use a low wattage amp, you can crank that mother up. I gig regularly with a 5 watt Epiphone Valve Jr. when I do rock and blues. there's not much clean there after 1/3 of the way up, but you can get a glorious grind that sounds huge. Unmiked for small venues (up to 60 people), miked through the PA for larger rooms.

If you want distortion, too much power will work against you. I've never needed more than 30 watts even squeaky clean and unmiked for any bar gig.

Edit: for reference, this an excellent heavy sound, when the guitars come in. Crank it up
http://youtu.be/xw722dGGvy4

Playing guitar and never playing for others is like studying medicine and never working in a clinic.Moondawgs on Reverbnation


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(@legendaryk4)
Trusted Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 59
21/11/2012 11:41 pm  

Ok so I think I finally understand and know what to look for. I'm over wanting a half stack so I don't need to worry about that. What you are saying basically sums to no matter the amp, tube or solid, 15+ watts should be able to be heard over a drum set correct?

I don't need anything huge, but I do want something that will be able to do small gigs and maybe some outdoor stuff. I preferably want a solid state combo because I get my tone from a multi fx pedal, Zoom G2.1DM. I'm saying this because people keep saying tubes are better sound for metal and such, but that doesn't really matter because I have the multi fx, or should it? Also, does that mean 30 watts should be able to do this?

Also, is there certain brands I should stay away from. I was looking at orange, peavey and Randall. I really like the looks of orange amps for some reason.


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(@legendaryk4)
Trusted Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 59

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(@moonrider)
Noble Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 1309
22/11/2012 11:18 am  

I don't need anything huge, but I do want something that will be able to do small gigs and maybe some outdoor stuff. I preferably want a solid state combo because I get my tone from a multi fx pedal, Zoom G2.1DM. I'm saying this because people keep saying tubes are better sound for metal and such, but that doesn't really matter because I have the multi fx, or should it? Also, does that mean 30 watts should be able to do this?

Ah. Now you've changed the need from a good all purpose rock amp to one that can make a modeling pedal sound best. They're exactly opposite requirements.

You'll want clean power, lots of headroom, and no "amp coloration" so the amp/cab models in your pedal are reproduced accurately.

Short answer: You don't want an amp, you want a PA. That's what works best with modelers.

Other short answer: Look at a powered PA speaker. You don't really need the mixer since you just want something to reproduce the modeler's sounds. it's not a conventional "look" but it's a whole lot easier to tweak into sounding right

This will probably be a perfect match for what you want to do:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audio/behringer-eurolive-b212d-active-pa-speaker-system

If you can, take your pedal to a store and try this type of setup. I think you'll like what you hear.

Playing guitar and never playing for others is like studying medicine and never working in a clinic.Moondawgs on Reverbnation


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(@legendaryk4)
Trusted Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 59
22/11/2012 1:21 pm  

I was looking at doing that a couple months ago, but I did a bunch of online searches if people do that and everyone said no or if they do it not the same reason that I wanted it for.

That looks like a good one though. I'll see if a guitar center around me has one for me to play with and I'll let you know why I think. Thank you for all the help.

Thank you.


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