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(@moonrider)
Noble Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 1309
16/09/2012 6:45 pm  

I still think the best way to go is to use your ears unless you are really stuck - I mean if you are in a jam night situation and you aren't really given any clues about the song besides the key of it - which of these will you do?

a.) Use your ears and lower your volume til you have got the changes right and be playing it by the end of the song
b.) Tell the people you are jamming with that you are sorry but you will have to go out and buy the sheet music then come back when it arrives

I was thinking more from the viewpoint of:

A producer hires you to do a guitar track. He's paying you $150 an hour, and the studio+engineer is costing him an equal amount. He wants you in and out as fast as he can possibly manage, because every 10 minutes is 50 bucks out of his pocket. He tosses you a chart, says "We're doing this with a triplet shuffle feel, let's go." You pop the headphones on, and you have 8 clicks for tempo before the track starts. What do you do?

a) Read the chart and deliver the goods
b) Explain that you need to hear the song first, and/or need to have someone transcribe it to tab, which wastes a couple hundred dollars worth of time, which gets you blacklisted as a poser across the entire region and you lose a significant chunk of your income

Tab's fine if you have the time to practice it, or in informal situations. It's a useful tool for less experienced guitarists. Ear training is an essential skill for all guitarists of any level.

But when you're expected to play a part you've never heard, exactly as the producer wants it, RIGHT NOW, sheet music is the ONLY thing that gives enough information to do it.

Playing guitar and never playing for others is like studying medicine and never working in a clinic.Moondawgs on Reverbnation


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(@trguitar)
Famed Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 3711
16/09/2012 8:24 pm  

Tab's fine if you have the time to practice it, or in informal situations. It's a useful tool for less experienced guitarists. Ear training is an essential skill for all guitarists of any level.

But when you're expected to play a part you've never heard, exactly as the producer wants it, RIGHT NOW, sheet music is the ONLY thing that gives enough information to do it.
True! If you are a professional/studio musician I think it would be expected you know how to read. I am a hobby musician, my skills at reading are very poor. I have a basic understanding. That, TAB and my ear get me by for what I do. On the other hand, I CAN read an EKG. This I need for my profession.

"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."-- The Webb Wilder Credo --


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(@imalone)
Reputable Member
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 267
16/09/2012 11:02 pm  

On the other hand, I CAN read an EKG. This I need for my profession.
Can you play an EKG?
(On bass I assume...)


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(@noteboat)
Famed Member
Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 4931
16/09/2012 11:13 pm  

In truth, more than 90% of the studio work I've ever done has involved a minute or so of instruction from the producer on what he wants, and then it's improvised on the spot. He (not sexist - so far I've never worked with a female producer) will then give me feedback for the second take, which should be pretty different from the first.

But it's the other 10% (the reading part) that gets you called back. Moonrider is spot on - time is money. Waste their money once and you don't ever get a second bite at the apple with that producer. There are lots of guitarists out there.

Tab is useful for some situations. Ears are indispensable if you want to make music for a living. But reading is that missing brick in the wall - if you can read, you have an edge.

There are 12 million guitarists in the US. More than 11 million can't read anything but tab. There are about 30,000 full time professional guitarists in the US (I'm one). Most of us can read standard notation pretty darn well. The way I see it, your chances of making a living over the long haul are about 1 in 40,000 if you can't read, and about 1 in 37 if you can read at sight.

I'm not anti-tab. I'm pro-skills. The more you have, the better you'll do.

Guitar teacher offering lessons in Plainfield IL


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(@trguitar)
Famed Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 3711
17/09/2012 12:17 am  

On the other hand, I CAN read an EKG. This I need for my profession.
Can you play an EKG?
(On bass I assume...)
Well, they do make that beeping sound. :mrgreen: Their tempo is in beats per minute too! It is best if you have a regular rhythm ..... ummm .. I could keep going. :D

This one by the way looks to be an acute inferior wall MI ..... not a good EKG to have. :(
They are in however regular sinus rhythm at a rate of 83 beats per minute. That part is good.
PR interval looks to be about .16
QRS about .08
QT interval about .36
There are significant ST elevations in leads II III & AVF with reciprocal changes in the lateral limb leads indicative of acute inferior wall myocardial infarction.

NoteBoat ...... The numbers have it. Great information! Yes, I would learn to read if I had any aspirations of being a professional guitarist. You make a very good point.

"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."-- The Webb Wilder Credo --


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(@greybeard)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 5900
17/09/2012 5:41 am  

TR,

there are some pretty hefty bends and dive bombs on those charts.

I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?Greybeard's PagesMy Articles & Reviews on GN


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(@trguitar)
Famed Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 3711
17/09/2012 6:01 am  

TR,

there are some pretty hefty bends and dive bombs on those charts.
So hefty that they cause chest pain! :lol:

"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."-- The Webb Wilder Credo --


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(@fleaaaaaa)
Honorable Member
Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 680
17/09/2012 8:10 am  

I still think the best way to go is to use your ears unless you are really stuck - I mean if you are in a jam night situation and you aren't really given any clues about the song besides the key of it - which of these will you do?

a.) Use your ears and lower your volume til you have got the changes right and be playing it by the end of the song
b.) Tell the people you are jamming with that you are sorry but you will have to go out and buy the sheet music then come back when it arrives

I was thinking more from the viewpoint of:

A producer hires you to do a guitar track. He's paying you $150 an hour, and the studio+engineer is costing him an equal amount. He wants you in and out as fast as he can possibly manage, because every 10 minutes is 50 bucks out of his pocket. He tosses you a chart, says "We're doing this with a triplet shuffle feel, let's go." You pop the headphones on, and you have 8 clicks for tempo before the track starts. What do you do?

a) Read the chart and deliver the goods
b) Explain that you need to hear the song first, and/or need to have someone transcribe it to tab, which wastes a couple hundred dollars worth of time, which gets you blacklisted as a poser across the entire region and you lose a significant chunk of your income

Tab's fine if you have the time to practice it, or in informal situations. It's a useful tool for less experienced guitarists. Ear training is an essential skill for all guitarists of any level.

But when you're expected to play a part you've never heard, exactly as the producer wants it, RIGHT NOW, sheet music is the ONLY thing that gives enough information to do it.

Yeah, well despite the fact I can play to reasonable level - I have decided I will probably never be a "professional" or session guitarist because my reading is not great and I don't have the desire to put the time into that. I learnt that on this forum :lol:

together we stand, divided we fall..........


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(@moonrider)
Noble Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 1309
17/09/2012 12:25 pm  

Yeah, well despite the fact I can play to reasonable level - I have decided I will probably never be a "professional" or session guitarist because my reading is not great and I don't have the desire to put the time into that. I learnt that on this forum :lol:

Man, "never" is such a long time. My studio dates and band gigs supplement my retirement pension. Learning a little bit every day adds up over 30 years.

Playing guitar and never playing for others is like studying medicine and never working in a clinic.Moondawgs on Reverbnation


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(@anonymous)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 8310
19/09/2012 10:21 am  

Well I was in a band with two brass players - one Sax and one trumpet and the trumpet player couldn't work out the middle break to I feel good by James Brown, which is mind numbingly simple and the keyboard player was showing her it note for note and she still concluded with "write it down for me" - just shows someone who has no *feel* for an instrument. I couldn't believe it, she had played her instrument as long as I had played mine and to me that is just a walk in the park.

everyone has blind spots in their playing. i have trouble learning songs in front of other people. even easy stuff, i've botched the changes the first few times through. and then you have to deal with not just learning it, but your embarrassment and all that stuff. i've spent years teaching, tutoring, and coaching, and trust me, everyone's made an ass of themselves doing something that's easy for someone else. try not to be too hard on people learning to do new things. even "feel" is learned, and if it really was as easy as you claimed, there wouldn't be so many stories about james brown being hard on his backing band.


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